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#1 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 6:11 am
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@jeffersonianideal Jefferson’s said, “I sincerely believe, with you, that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies.” I am simply suggesting and quoting, yes it is speculation, however I personally do not think Jefferson, a former slave owner, one whom referred to Native American as “savages”, and wanted assimilation of indigenous people would be my deity for how to live politically with the exception of “separation of church and state.” Just keep listening to Ayn Rand.
#2 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 6:52 am
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@sisque16 You keep insisting, “Jefferson suggested”. Where is an actual quote? I maintain that if there is no such direct reference by Jefferson, your assertion is pure speculation. Once again, Jefferson may have been enamored by another culture’s way of governing themselves but there is no evidence to suggest Jefferson was a proponent of anarchy. His words in the Declaration and Constitution remain the best evidence for this. What government educational institution sold this junk to you?
#3 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 6:58 am
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@jeffersonianideal Jefferson suggested the private sector can be more dangerous than standing armies. As for anarchist, Jefferson admired native american for its communal ways of living and its lack of gov’t, however as for the U.S, Jefferson demanded a gov’t with “consent by governed.” Jefferson’s attempt to create equality is something that I admire, or as Adam Smith said “under perfect liberty you’ll have perfect equality.” The notion of his statement is admirable yet unsustainable.
#4 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 7:40 am
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@sisque16 Jefferson said a banking institutions, not the private sector was more dangerous than standing armies. You are correct, it is another one of your misinterpretations. Certainly a central bank like the FED would fit into that category. I will grant you that if anything makes the private sector dangerous, it is an all too cozy relationship with government. Jefferson was not an anarchist. He believed in minimal government. That would make him a minarchist.
#5 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 8:19 am
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@unoitaliano As socialist, we believe in humanism, not a cellestial dictator such as a god that doesn’t exist or believing on faith that a private sector tyranny is better than gov’t of, by and for the people.
#6 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 8:43 am
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@jeffersonianideal I am using Jefferson’s word to caution even a libertarian, that private sector can be more dangerous that standing armies. Now that is what Jefferson suggested, so I am either clearly misinterpreting his words or your ignorant to them. Jefferson’s core beliefs are at the root anarchist at best. When you have the Tea-party advocating succession from the union,tax-cuts from 01-09 while creating a deficit, where was the Tea-party on the deficit then, they’re hypocrites.
#7 by jaimondrow on August 9, 2010 - 9:42 am
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good lord.. paul destroys him..
#8 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 10:03 am
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@rowenagoldfarb Thank you fellow libertarian and logical thinker, for your enthusiastic support. Many Tea Party members have their own political and religious agendas and they do not reflect the even keeled principles associated with libertarian doctrines. It is similar to fundamentalist Christians who espouse to love the Jews because they can’t wait to convert them in order to fulfill Bible prophecy. If you recall the Twilight Zone episode entitled, “To Serve Man.” It is similar to that.
#9 by rowenagoldfarb on August 9, 2010 - 10:10 am
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@jeffersonianideal I’m not sure how this reply thing works but I’m giving it a shot. Your words here reflect my views exactly in terms of the two main factions of the tea party movement. I will go a step further though and say that they were hijacked by the neocons totally. What began as a money bomb to raise money for Dr. Paul eventually was hijacked by Fox News, Sarah Palin and others of the like. It is also my understanding that you are right about Dr. Paul’s view on abortion.
#10 by rowenagoldfarb on August 9, 2010 - 10:44 am
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My mouth dropped open when Matthews said that all libertarians with whom he has spoken tell him that they are against gay marriage and abortion. Huh? I’ve never heard of such a thing. I do know that individual libertarians might have differences of opinions on the abortion issue but the gay marriage deal? With whom has Matthews been speaking, I’d like to know. Whomever, he/she sounds like a fake libertarian.
#11 by grahmnash1 on August 9, 2010 - 11:24 am
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“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people’s money”…Margret Thatcher.
#12 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 11:39 am
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@sisque16 I am aware of your attempt to misinterpret Jefferson’s words to support your unsustainable premise. Almost all Libertarians are opposed to a central bank, the federal reserve system and advocate a return to the gold standard. But anyone who believes that slavery would still exist in 2010 without intervention from dishonest Abe, is delusional. The were several factors working to make the inefficient institution of slavery obsolete, such as the emergence of the industrial revolution.
#13 by futbolfever90 on August 9, 2010 - 11:58 am
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Cunt Matthews
#14 by jeremy8080 on August 9, 2010 - 12:45 pm
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We need Chris to interview Ron Paul more often!
He smacked down every question Matthews asked!
#15 by wunderbeast on August 9, 2010 - 1:13 pm
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matthews couldn’t care less about all the golden nuggets dropping out of dr. paul’s mouth. he continues to belittle him and talk about things that have nothing to do with actual principles. it’s kind of infuriating to see a douche sideline an honest statesman like that.
#16 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 1:26 pm
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@jeffersonianideal I used Jefferson to show you that even he cautioned the people of the private sector, especially the private banks, not gov’t. Jefferson own views on private property unfortunately would allow slavery to continue, he argued “innate morality” would work, (which it does not, “innate morality” is the same as a moral relativist),etc. Jefferson’s main concern was too much gov’t can essentially become tyrannical; moreover that we have three branches of gov’t.
#17 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 2:02 pm
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@jeffersonianideal Oh please! To prove your point you cite a Libertarian institute. The reason I mentioned to cite from a Liberal is to show your lack of literature opposing your viewpoint, moreover convincing a socialist such as myself would be more credible. Why do you think I cite a BBC article to prove the Omnibus Bill created a surplus, your either denying fact or my evidence is an illusion to you?
#18 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 2:26 pm
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@sisque16 You did not answer my reasonable and pertinent questions but I will answer yours. You use the wisdom of Jefferson to prove my point. It is the people who must create and protect liberty. Such a responsibility should never be entrusted to government. We have already seen the results in the last 100 years of allowing government to be the guardian and regulator of freedom. That is why Jefferson sought to “bind their hands from mischief through the chains of the constitution.”
#19 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 3:14 pm
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@sisque16 Neither the conservative nor liberal, Ludwig von Mises Institute: “The surplus deception is clearly discernible in the statistics of national debt. While the spenders are boasting about surpluses, the national debt is rising year after year. In 1998, the first year of the legerdemain surplus, it rose from $5.413 trillion to $5.526 trillion, due to a deficit of $112.9 billion. Since then it has risen to $5.643 trillion today, October 15, 2000, with another deficit of $117 billion.”
#20 by virtuousvoice on August 9, 2010 - 3:45 pm
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i would have loved living in america in the late 19th or early 20th century before it was ruined by big government liberals, cops, and the pc crowd.
#21 by drizztmay on August 9, 2010 - 3:58 pm
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I love this man
#22 by bsprite217 on August 9, 2010 - 4:38 pm
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~*~Rand Paul for President 2012~*~
#23 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 5:19 pm
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@sisque16 Look, I think Ron Paul and libertarians are sincere in their beliefs, I think your/his views on Non-interventionism, spending cuts on homeland security, his analysis on terrorism are constutitional and are fundamentally accurate with my beliefs, however in terms of economics I strongly disagree and am willing to take under consideration evidence that would illustrate tax cuts to the top 1%, would increase middle-class incomes, show trickle down economics benefits poor people, etc.
#24 by sisque16 on August 9, 2010 - 6:19 pm
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@jeffersonianideal Show evidence, that shows the Omnibus Bill was ineffective at creating a surplus by a liberal columnist, intellectual, etc. The reason I emphasized “Liberal” because many conservatives agree with the results, they disagree with the principle. Why do you fear the gov’t? Jefferson suggested banks needed to be regulated by gov’t, and argued unfortunately, “gov’t cannot create a right to liberty.” This message would allow slavery to exist today b/c human have “innate morality.”
#25 by jeffersonianideal on August 9, 2010 - 7:06 pm
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@unoitaliano I appreciate your support. I promote the cause of liberty to many socialists and neo-conservatives. I am used to their contempt but never shirk from my beliefs. Most of us once belonged to another political party before discovering the logical and ethical principles of libertarianism. I am confident that many will awaken one day. I also trust that these virtuous political ideals would stand on their own, as natural rights, with or without the intervention from a supreme deity.